16 replies to this topic

[Higgins]

Here are some links if you are interested in the other mob's views of how their outfit went in the loss to Waikato last time out. It will give you sometime to focus on (other than how many tries they are going to let in) to see what, if any, improvement the Bay of Plenty have managed to make.


http://www.bayofplen...-to-ri/3918336/

http://www.rotoruada...g-loss/3918383/

http://www.bayofplen...ust-a-/3918576/

[Bay boy Tim]

In the 39 matches played between the two “Bays” Bay of Plenty have won 24, loss 14 and drawn one. Last year it took a Hawkes Bay touchdown in the last play of the game, for the visitors to the Rotorua International Stadium, to post a 22-19 victory.

Yeah boy!

[Stockcar86]

Teams announced:

TEAMS:

Hawke's Bay: 1. Kas Lealamanua, 2. Hikawera Elliot, 3. Clint Newland, 4. Bryn Evans, 5. Ross Kennedy, 6. Michael Johnson, 7. Karl Lowe, 8. Mike Coman, 9. Kahn Fotuali'i, 10. Andrew Horrell, 11. Zac Guildford, 12. Ryan McLeod, 13. Jason Shoemark (captain), 14. Richard Buckman, 15. Luke Rooney.

Reserves: 16. Eugene Smith, 17. Anthony Perenise, 18. Leighton Price, 19. Grant Webb, 20. Chris Eaton, 21. Star Timu, 22. Mark Jackman.

Bay of Plenty: 1. Joe Savage or James McGougan, 2. John Pareanga, 3. Josh Hohneck, 4. Luke Andrews, 5. Culum Retallick, 6. Solomon King, 7. Tanerau Latimer, 8. Colin Bourke (captain), 9. Taniela Moa, 10. Daniel Waenga, 11. Jason Hona, 12. Grant McQuoid, 13. Brett Mather, 14. Lance MacDonald, 15. Toby Arnold.

Reserves: 16. Simon Chisholm, 17. McGougan or Savage, 18. Aidan Kuka, 19. Luke Braid, 20. Chad Tuoro, 21. Phil Burleigh, 22. Lelia Masaga.


After a strong showing last week, Trent Boswell-Wakefield drops out of the 22 to make way for Michael Johnson. Kirkpatrick is still out with his head knock, so Horrell starts at 10. U20 player Star Timu comes into the back reserves.

Surprising (to me) that Rooney has been kept at 15. Hopefully a hard week at training has sorted out the issues he showed last week.

Really looking forward to the 6-7-8 battle for each side

Hopefully a good welcome home given to Bourke and Waenga, and a solid 4 try win to the home team!!

Edited by Stockcar86, 05 August 2010 - 09:57 AM.

[Higgins]

Bay boy Tim said:

In the 39 matches played between the two “Bays” Bay of Plenty have won 24, loss 14 and drawn one. Last year it took a Hawkes Bay touchdown in the last play of the game, for the visitors to the Rotorua International Stadium, to post a 22-19 victory.

Yeah boy!

49 games over such a long period of time is not that many. One can only assume that for many years one team or the other must have been too weak to consider playing, that or the dreaded old Napier Taupo Road may have prevented more regular matches taking place.

[Stockcar86]

The assistant manager for the Magpies is a sparky, currently working at my folks house in Napier. I've asked my parents to pass on the message to give Kaka a run ahead of Rooney.

[Nepia]

Bay boy Tim said:

In the 39 matches played between the two “Bays” Bay of Plenty have won 24, loss 14 and drawn one. Last year it took a Hawkes Bay touchdown in the last play of the game, for the visitors to the Rotorua International Stadium, to post a 22-19 victory.

Yeah boy!

Ok, what is up with the stats? These are from a skysport article:
HEAD TO HEAD: Played 41 – Hawke's Bay 23, Bay of Plenty 17, drawn 1.
http://www.skysport....id=55&cid=28211

So what are the correct stats? Or are they both the home team stats?

[Higgins]

Click here for the match previews

http://www.bayofplen...-drawn/3918754/

http://www.hawkesbay...eamers/3918711/

Funny how both writers see everything exactly the same. Still waiting for the one from Rotorua to appear and hopefuuly it will offer a different perspective.

Edited by Higgins, 06 August 2010 - 03:52 PM.

[skaapa]

Well done BOP, you outplayed, out thought, outpassioned us tonight.

Who or what is going to ignite this team into action, into playing the brand of rugby we saw last year?

Please Mr Russell, give the captaincy to Elliot, Evans or Lowe. Shoemark looks like he has packed his bags already for Exeter and is waiting to board the plane!

Very disappointing effort from the boys. Roll on Tasman, hopefully someone or something can get the season back on track or a top 7 position will slip away.

[KiwiPie]

Can you please courier over our title of the real Bay please, Hawkes fans? Use bubblewrap.

[Higgins]

I can't even begin to express my disappointment at the feeble capitulation in the last 15 minutes. It was so distressing that I am seriously concerned about Tasman in Blenheim next round. Friday night was so yuck that at this stage I think getting a bonus for getting within seven would be an achievement. That would rely on Tasman getting only the seven points themselves, anymore than that looks like it will be way beyond the Magpies if their attacking performances put on so far are any indication. That doesn't even start take into consideration defensive frailties.
Still I will still be backing our guys 17+

Here are the first of the match reviews for those that have the stomach for it this time around.

http://www.hawkesbay...-glory/3918792/
http://www.bayofplen...rpunch/3918805/

Here is a question to ponder. Is the Melbourne outfit paying the HBRFU to play L Rooney in the hope that he might learn something about the game in time for next years Super 15 or are the HBRFU paying L Rooney for his services because he is a better player than any of the locally based aletrnatives?

Finally congratulations KP I have no argument about the result. The ex Bay were simply terrible and no amount of finger pointing at anything or anybody can hide that fact. The Magpie supporters have to take it on the chin.

Edited by Higgins, 08 August 2010 - 04:04 PM.

[Nepia]

Nepia's analysis of the match. I haven't been able to bring myself to watch my recording of the game so this is the live view.
The Magpies look uncoached. Basically their success of the past 3 years has been built on string coaching, effective gameplans, effective selection and the promotion of young talent. None of that was evident last night.

The Magpies were rudderless. A few Magpies forwards lived up to the hype - Hika was again the best player on the park.
Combine this with the new guys not geling. Fotuali'i was awful, nowhere near his best, hopefully he can't get worse. Although my mate did say that all was well with the world, that even though Fotuali'i was crap Eaton still looked worse when he came on.

The HB backs aren't working. McLeod does nothing except take the ball up, often not getting over the advantage line, and miss tackles in midfield. That is all. Shoemark is well off the pace and doesn't look to be up to this level this year - maybe he needs to move in one. Horrell is a good player but looks best suited one out. Guildford is extremely out of sorts. I guess he needs to sort out his off field issues that everyone in the Bay (whoops HB) seems to know about. I have been pleasantly surprised by Buckman's form, his workrate is great if not 100% accurate at times. I expect Fotuali'i to come right.

The forwards have been better than the backs in two weeks, just. Newlands is now a 40 min player, not 60, Perenise needed to come on earlier. Evans has been largely anonymous this season, selection for the ABs has done a Guildford on him and made him worse. I'm not sold on Corman, he looks the part, but he doesn't seem to do the work that Waldrom did last year (aside from the big runs). Lowe and Johnson battled well, but Lowe's game is less effective when the backs aren't doing anything and he's basically a tight forward.

Bay of Plenty looked the goods across the park. I mentioned their bench ion the lead up to the game and it proved to be a real bonus for them. Basically BoP look a well coached team and have firepower all over the park. They have timed there run perfectly for the 7/7 split I think. The two ex Magpies Bourke and Waenga were obviously primed for big ones, that is probably the best game I've seen from Waenga on McLean Park. Masaga is definitely a good buy - wish we'd picked him up instead of Sinoti and Rooney. Mather was good value in midfield and I'd expect Burleigh to overtake McQuoid at 12 next week. In the end I was happy that BoP got there bonus point for four tries, they were definitely deserved winners on the day.

I don't really want to have a go at the ref lest anyone thinks I'm trying to make excuses for the Magpies. I'm not, they were tutae and deserved to lose. But the reffing team were awful. BoP were lucky to have thrown two balls in straight to the lineout on my side of the field and only got called for one not straight. Zac was penalised for doing the same thing the BoP player did in the same movement. What player deliberately knocks a ball down when chasing an attacking kick? The offside line was also non existent.


My first time sitting in the new stand and it is very comfortable. The seats are nicely spaced apart, large males don't have to be packed in like sardines, there is easy access.
The only drawback is the distance from the field. I wish that cricket could get their own park (no offense cricket fans but I just like my rugby about 1000 times more.)

Nepias analysis of the Magpies this year:
Unfortunately my thoughts preseason have so far been true.

I think the first mistake was the co-coaches decision. Co-coaches never work, there has to be one person in charge of the waka. The lack of structure in the Magpies may be reflective of this.

Secondly, Berquist loss is huge, the backline is 100% less disfunctional with an experienced and solid general. Horrell and Kirkpatrick are not at that level as yet. I've said it time and time again but I think it is a key point.

Thirdly, we haven't made astute purchases in the off season - in fact we've basically lost the HB heart of the team. I agree with Skaapa about Shoemark, he looks ineffective and the captaincy should be given to Elliott (or Johnson). On Elliott, don't fetchin take him off the field, ever. He is our best player (on the evidence of the last few years and the last two matches), even at the end of the game playing a hard 60 - 70 mins he is still better than Smith. I was not surprised that it was Elliott, Johnson, and to a lesser extent Lowe that were the best performers for us on Friday. Rooney is just not good enough at 15, maybe give him a shot on the wing. We've got another wing who's injured to come in that no one really knows how good he is, meanwhile the coaches have had the club season to watch the up and comers yet our new purchases seem to be guaranteed starts. (I have heard grumblings from my Havelock friends about their low representation in the team).

Two years back when we were floundering early I always expected us to come back, this year I'm not confident. The balance of our squad just doesn't look right. Our key deficiency of last year has been covered (halfback) however we don't have the right firepower outside for this change to be beneficial. Maybe I'm just turning into a negative bastard in my old age, but I fear we may be back to our 2nd division purgatory for a few years - I hope not though.

[BOPRED]

For me it was strength from the bench that made the difference for us. This is something that we are not used to. And we havent got our 1st 15 back yet.

CURRAGH J. is a star.

[Hooroo]

Nepia said:

I think the first mistake was the co-coaches decision. Co-coaches never work, there has to be one person in charge of the waka. The lack of structure in the Magpies may be reflective of this.

It seems to work for Southland.

It's a shame that Newlands isn't fitter as he really has a massive influence when playing. Just a monster of a man. What is he 6'4"?? 300kg's??

[Baron Silas Greenback]

Hooroo said:

It seems to work for Southland.

It's a shame that Newlands isn't fitter as he really has a massive influence when playing. Just a monster of a man. What is he 6'4"?? 300kg's??

I dont rate Newlands at all. As a BOP supporter I was pleased wehen he was on the field. he gives away stupid penalties and isnt really that good at scrummaging.. add tthe fact he is slow around the track and he is average.
I was very concerned about Elliot though, that boy made some serious yards every time he got the ball. I breathed a sigh of relief when he was subbed off.

[Higgins]

Click here for an action shot that shows we must have the full compliment on the field so can't use that as a mitigating factor

http://www.rotoruada....nz/sport/news/

Would include a copy here but not sure if it is subject to copyright so you will have to make do with using the link

[Chainsaw]

Wow - Wellington, Hawke's Bay and Otago all lose!

[BOPRED]

Chainsaw said:

Wow - Wellington, Hawke's Bay and Otago all lose!

Dont forget Auckland and Canterbury so close to the Manawatu they should give the points back. But thats another thread