21 replies to this topic

[shark]

These were named today and are as follows:

Quote

ODI squad:

Brendon McCullum © - Otago Volts
Michael Bates - Auckland Aces
Doug
Bracewell - Central Stags
Dean Brownlie - Canterbury Wizards
Andrew Ellis
- Canterbury Wizards
Martin Guptill - Auckland Aces
Tom Latham - Cantebury
Wizards
Nathan McCullum - Otago Volts
Kyle Mills - Auckland Aces
Tarun
Nethula - Central Stags
Rob Nicol - Canterbury Wizards
Jacob Oram -
Central Stags
Tim Southee - Northern Knights
Kane Williamson - Northern Knights

Twenty20 squad:

Brendon McCullum © - Otago Volts
Michael Bates - Auckland Aces
Doug
Bracewell - Central Stags
Dean Brownlie - Canterbury Wizards
Colin de
Grandhomme - Auckland Aces
James Franklin - Wellington Firebirds
Martin
Guptill - Auckland Aces
Ronnie Hira - Auckland Aces
Nathan McCullum -
Otago Volts
Kyle Mills - Auckland Aces
Rob Nicol - Canterbury
Wizards
Jacob Oram - Central Stags
Tim Southee - Northern Knights
Kane
Williamson - Northern Knights

One thing that struck me immediately, despite the fact the selectors are clearly blooding new players against relatively soft opposition, has Piggy retired from all international cricket? Because if not, I'd certainly have him in my ODI squad at least, especially in Rosco's absence. Also, James Franklin was a fixture in the ODI side recently, and now can't make the squad. I couldn't care less about T20.

Obviously they'll be rotating throughout the series, but if we were 1-1 going into the final ODI, this would be my first XI:

B McCullum
Guptill
Nicol
Williamson
Brownlie
Oram
Ellis
N McCullum
Bracewell
Mills
Southee

Very light on experienced specialist batsmen and heavy on all-rounders (or perhaps more appropriately, bowlers who can bat), but the only other batsman in the 14 is Latham and I'd take a more hardened all-rounder in the likes of Ellis over such a greenhorn. However, we do bat to 11 including plenty of grunt, and there are five seamers and three spin options in this XI.

[Chris B.]

Lots to like about those squads. Definitely experimental and building depth - most notable is the omission of Vettori - will be very interesting to see how we go without him. I think, sadly, the Pig has retired from all international cricket.

I'm particularly pleased to see de Grandhomme, Hira and Nethula appearing in the lists, while Ellis, Bates and Nicol also very deserving on their performances. Latham a bit of a surprise from left field.

[hydro11]

Latham was clearly Taylor's replacement. Taylor got injured, the selectors had no clue who to pick and decided to give him a go because he got a good knock. I think with him you are really selecting on potential rather than results. I would like to see him spend another few years in first class cricket before getting the call up. I would pick him in the one dayers because there is not much batting depth in that squad. Probably would play Latham for Ellis. I didn't realise that Ellis had such a high batting average but I still don't think you need all the bowling that that team gives you.

[Crazy Horse]

Is Ellis bowling again? The last I heard he was playing as a batter only because he was recovering from injury.

[SouthernMan]

Has he ever bowled??

To my knowledge all he ever did was throw or chuck balls down at around 120k's. I'm a little bemused by his selection.

[mimic]

maybe i should change my name to andrew ellis and move to canterbury.. i'd probably get called up to represent nz

[shark]

Interesting guys, because I'm yet to see anyone who has a clue criticise Ellis' selection, and he was consistently praised by commentators during the HRV Cup.

Hydro is correct in that the XI I'd pick could afford to drop a seamer, but I'd still back Ellis' experience with the bat over Lathams' extremely raw talent in a crunch match.

[Virgil]

Strange call to drop Franklin, played a couple valuable innings what 6 months ago?..maybe less?
Always exciting though to see new talent being tried. Pig gone, Vettori sticking to Tests, not many of the old guard still there (Just Oram but he will be injured 4 balls into his first spell anyway)

[SouthernMan]

I just don't see much point in picking a twenty nine year old domestic toiler, sure he's had a decent season, but he's definitely the sort of all rounder we would have picked in the past... not great with either bat or ball, but ok with both. Sure he can smack domestic attacks around, but I have a feeling he could be found out once he walks out against a decent attack and as for his military medium's - I can just imagine the SOuth African's watching highlight videos and licking their lips.

If we were going to pick a player in the all rounder moul with an eye to the future ( and excuse me while I put my blue and gold eye patch on), I think Jimmy Neesham would have been a better pick. Only 21, can hit it as well as anyone and with a bit of work could become a very handy third or fourth seemer.

[fatbaldbloke]

I would have picked Franklin in a heartbeat over Oram, who really doesn't bring much to the table nowadays .

[hydro11]

Franklin was great before the world cup but didn't take his few chances in that tournament or against Zimbabwe. Oram vs Franklin depends on what sort of player you need. Oram is the far better bowler and Franklin is the far better batsman. If you pick Franklin, you have 4 bowlers and then Franklin and Nicol have to bowl at least ten overs between them. Oram can actually bowl 10 overs so is better for the team's balance.

[Immenso Rapido]

Kane Williamson. Cursed by being a good T20 bowler.

While it is good for his involvement (and employment) at domestic level, it won't help his development at this stage of his career as a test player if it means he gets selected for NZ.

I assume this will now mean he won't fit in any Plunket Shield matches before the SA test series. Bugger.

Edited by Immenso Rapido, 30 January 2012 - 11:01 AM.

[rotated]

Immenso Rapido said:

Kane Williamson. Cursed by being a good T20 bowler.

While it is good for his involvement (and employment) at domestic level, it won't help his development at this stage of his career as a test player if it means he gets selected for NZ.

I assume this will now mean he fit in any Plunket Shield match before the SA test series. Bugger.

Once long term test batting prospects like Kane are identified they should really quarantine them from T20 unless that's the only cricket happening in the country or it is a very important international tournament that can raise coin for NZC.

With Ryder coming back from injury for the SA series is Williamson's place in the team even secure at this point? If we play 5 bowlers either Williamson or Brownlie seem the candidates to drop out.

[mariner4life]

Wow, i actually agree with Rotated. Kane Williamson should be nowhere near the T20 team, it would be nice to have a couple of test batsmen where that is their sole focus. Seems to have worked out alright with Michael Clarke.

[Immenso Rapido]

rotated said:

With Ryder coming back from injury for the SA series is Williamson's place in the team even secure at this point? If we play 5 bowlers either Williamson or Brownlie seem the candidates to drop out.

No it isn't secure, but then neither should it be (within reason - e.g. not crazy Glenn Turner like selection policy). With only 3 places in the team for non-opening specialist batsmen, and one of those taken up by the captain.

But, I think it is fairly secure. I struggle to emphasise how much Ryder disappointed me in Australia. I think he may have done his cause in Wright's eyes a lot of damage. it should take a lot of work/numbers before he overtakes any of the current middle order.

While I acknowledge he has 'talent', I now suspect he my be a FTB. And with our 4 man pace attack I don't think we will be producing too many flat tracks at home for the next few seasons. Even if he is at a level above FTB, I suspect he has a touch of the Damien Martyns, a predictable scoring area that good teams can dry up, flood his areas with catchers, and turn his strength into a weakness by encouraging him to slap it through point with no foot movement.

Despite my reservations, I still think he is next cab off the rank if Taylor is not fit. Longer term he will need to adjust or he will get left behind.

[Sprinko]

SouthernMan said:

If we were going to pick a player in the all rounder moul with an eye to the future ( and excuse me while I put my blue and gold eye patch on), I think Jimmy Neesham would have been a better pick. Only 21, can hit it as well as anyone and with a bit of work could become a very handy third or fourth seemer.

You're a good man SM :-)

Needs a couple of solid productive first class seasons first, but he's a champ!

[Mokey]

Very interesting, the Oram selection. Not getting any younger, injury plagued and best years far, far behind him. Few left field calls, but definitely time for some of these players to show whether or not they can make the step up to the next level, the HRV Cup is ok, but its not the biggest acid test in world cricket.

[Chiefy]

Definitely surprised by some of the selections in these squads. I think with his form in the HRV Cup and being by far our quickest bowler should have been enough to get Adam Milne a spot. Games against Zimbabwe might have been just the ticket for him to get going in International cricket. He was a better bet than Bates IMO, who I think will be proved to be too slow for International cricket, unless he can maintain excellent accuracy like Kyle Mills.

The selection of Colin de Grandhomme could be interesting if he is used correctly. I think NZ should use him as a floating pinch hitter, where he can be used anywhere from downwards in the order.

I also agree with others who suggest Williamson should have been kept for just ODIs and Tests at this stage. Although now that he is there I hope we see him used plenty at the bowling crease against Zimbabwe.

[rotated]

Mokey said:

Very interesting, the Oram selection. Not getting any younger, injury plagued and best years far, far behind him. Few left field calls, but definitely time for some of these players to show whether or not they can make the step up to the next level, the HRV Cup is ok, but its not the biggest acid test in world cricket.

Littlejohn actually gave a pretty decent explanation of the rationale for selecting the T20 squad, for an Aussie lawn bowler at least. The aim is the World Cup later in the year and they want to get a look at as many prospects as possible. Reading between the lines Franklin will likely play extensively in the IPL to state his case, so it's better using the spots for other all-rounder options without international experience.

[scruffy-lookin]

Which is fine – apart from the fact that you will probably only learn so much from seeing a player against Zimbabwe and we should probably be playing our best team against SA.

There is also the need to build team cohesion and get everyone comfortable with their role in the team which is hard to do when such a big group of players is being used. Still, the depth may turn out to be handy and T20 seems to be a game in which fringe players can hit a hot streak.

[scruffy-lookin]

Rain radar and forecast for Dunedin are both good. Anyone down there who can look out a window?

Don’t know about the team probable team on cricinfo – looks a little light on batting to me:

New Zealand: (probable) 1 Rob Nicol, 2 Martin Guptill, 3 Brendon McCullum (capt & wk), 4 Tom Latham, 5 Dean Brownlie/Kane Williamson, 6 Nathan McCullum, 7 Doug Bracewell, 8 Andrew Ellis, 9 Jacob Oram, 10 Kyle Mills, 11 Tim Southee
Wouldn’t have thought that we’d need that many bowlers - especially on when the pitch is expected to offer some seam with helpful overhead conditions. Six bowlers or bowling all-rounders, Nicol and possibly Williamson seems excessive.

Pretty inexperienced ODI batting lineup other than McCullum and Guptil (if Oram is now primarily a bowler) so playing one specialist less than usual seems unnecessarily risky. I know they want to have a look at players but if it isn’t a team you’d play against top opposition I don’t think it should be played against the Zimbos.

[Immenso Rapido]

scruffy-lookin said:

Rain radar and forecast for Dunedin are both good. Anyone down there who can look out a window?

Don’t know about the team probable team on cricinfo – looks a little light on batting to me:

New Zealand: (probable) 1 Rob Nicol, 2 Martin Guptill, 3 Brendon McCullum (capt & wk), 4 Tom Latham, 5 Dean Brownlie/Kane Williamson, 6 Nathan McCullum, 7 Doug Bracewell, 8 Andrew Ellis, 9 Jacob Oram, 10 Kyle Mills, 11 Tim Southee
Wouldn’t have thought that we’d need that many bowlers - especially on when the pitch is expected to offer some seam with helpful overhead conditions. Six bowlers or bowling all-rounders, Nicol and possibly Williamson seems excessive.

Pretty inexperienced ODI batting lineup other than McCullum and Guptil (if Oram is now primarily a bowler) so playing one specialist less than usual seems unnecessarily risky. I know they want to have a look at players but if it isn’t a team you’d play against top opposition I don’t think it should be played against the Zimbos.

Articles I have read online today on stuff, were about Latham getting debut at 4, and Brownlie in a role as number 6 finisher.

So yes, that cricinfo probable team is likely wrong.
Latham 4, Williamson 5, Brownlie 6
One of those seam bowlers to be rotated out.